Chat Transcripts

Topic

Chat Session 2

Date

2025-12-03

Group ID

0

Course ID

308116

User List

Athey, LisaDougan, PeterJirele, AnnKelly, LoriKlatt-Simpson, DeborahKronebusch, MichelleMottram, NicholeNeuman, JenniferSimpson, StevenWaters, Danielle{Hafner, Nancy}
User Timestamp Message
{Hafner, Nancy}06:52:43 pmWelcome to chat on this frigid winter evening!
Jirele, Ann06:54:35 pmHi Nancy!
{Hafner, Nancy}06:54:47 pmHello Ann, how are you this evening?
Jirele, Ann06:55:01 pmI'm cold!
{Hafner, Nancy}06:55:13 pmMe too!
Jirele, Ann06:55:25 pmJust turned on the space heater. How are you today?
{Hafner, Nancy}06:56:08 pmBusy trying to prepare for spring courses so I can enjoy my winter break over the holidays! šŸ™‚
{Hafner, Nancy}06:58:11 pmIt looks like we will have many last-minute joiners tonight!
{Hafner, Nancy}06:58:28 pmHi Michelle
Kronebusch, Michelle06:58:29 pmSorry! Had to finish up last minute cleaning before I jumped on!
Simpson, Steven06:58:50 pmHi everyone
{Hafner, Nancy}06:58:50 pmNo worries! we still have 2 minutes
{Hafner, Nancy}06:58:58 pmWelcome, Steven
Klatt-Simpson, Deborah06:59:13 pmGood evening
{Hafner, Nancy}06:59:23 pmHi Deborah
Kelly, Lori07:00:17 pmHi
{Hafner, Nancy}07:00:38 pmWelcome Lori
{Hafner, Nancy}07:01:02 pmI see Danielle has joined us as well!
Waters, Danielle07:01:09 pmHello!
Mottram, Nichole07:01:18 pmHello all!
{Hafner, Nancy}07:01:27 pmWe have a big topic tonight, so let's get started *
Neuman, Jennifer07:01:35 pm*
Jirele, Ann07:01:45 pm*
Simpson, Steven07:01:48 pm*
Athey, Lisa07:01:52 pm*
Mottram, Nichole07:01:58 pm*
Klatt-Simpson, Deborah07:01:59 pm**
Kelly, Lori07:02:06 pm*
Kronebusch, Michelle07:02:39 pm***
{Hafner, Nancy}07:02:55 pmAccording to CSEFEL, "challenging behavior" is defined as any repeated pattern of behavior that interferes with learning or engagement in pro-social interactions with peers and adults; it is behaviors that are not responsive to the use of developmentally appropriate guidance procedures.
{Hafner, Nancy}07:03:05 pmWhat words stand out for you in this definition?
Klatt-Simpson, Deborah07:03:26 pmInteractions
Simpson, Steven07:03:33 pmRepeated pattern of behavior
Kelly, Lori07:03:39 pmRepeated pattern of behavior
Waters, Danielle07:03:40 pmRepeated
Neuman, Jennifer07:03:44 pmrepeated pattern
Dougan, Peter07:03:57 pmRepeated
Jirele, Ann07:04:01 pmbehaviors that are not responsive to the use of developmentally appropriate guidance procedures
Mottram, Nichole07:04:06 pminterferes with learning and engagement
Athey, Lisa07:04:21 pmYes, not responsive to appropriate guidance
Kronebusch, Michelle07:04:36 pmRepeated behavior at not responsive to appropriate guidance
{Hafner, Nancy}07:06:10 pmYes! you picked up on some important characteristics that differentiate "challenging" from typical, age-related behaviors that most children demonstrate at some point in their lives. "repeated patterns," "interferes with learning or engagement", does not respond to "appropriate guidance" strategies.
{Hafner, Nancy}07:07:13 pmWhat examples of behavior have you experienced in your program recently that align to the CSEFEL definition of "challenging"?
Simpson, Steven07:08:09 pmHittingā€¦ not using their words
Waters, Danielle07:08:13 pmStruggling with transitions between routines.
Athey, Lisa07:08:29 pmrepeatedly hurting "friends", hitting, biting, destroying things that belong to others.
Kronebusch, Michelle07:08:34 pmRefusal to participate in group activities
Kelly, Lori07:08:55 pmGentle hands, keep your hands to yourself, no hitting
Jirele, Ann07:09:09 pmI'd mentioned we have a child with high functioning autism that is pushing A LOT. Working with parents and OT and we haven't really found the reason behind it
Klatt-Simpson, Deborah07:09:29 pmNot listening, whining, tattling
Neuman, Jennifer07:09:36 pmtransitions and aggressive behaviors towards others
Jirele, Ann07:10:13 pmalso seeing biting and pinching/squeezing from others
Mottram, Nichole07:10:36 pmRecently, I have what feels like "echoing" behaviors such as pushing or bopping on top of the head. The rotation is ever-changing between which children choose this method of behavior, but I can confidently define the reason behind the behavior. Fatigue, sickness, milestone, etc. Always reminding myself that repeated behaviors need just as much counter consistency in navigating alternative outcomes and patience.
{Hafner, Nancy}07:11:00 pmI would like to use the examples shared by Jennifer and Danielle about challenges with transitions. *
Klatt-Simpson, Deborah07:11:12 pm*
Jirele, Ann07:11:16 pm*
Simpson, Steven07:11:17 pm*
Mottram, Nichole07:11:20 pm*
Neuman, Jennifer07:11:21 pm*
Athey, Lisa07:11:29 pm*
Kelly, Lori07:11:38 pm*
Kronebusch, Michelle07:12:24 pm*
{Hafner, Nancy}07:12:46 pmOn page 2 of the lecture notes, we consider reasons for challenging behaviors. Do you think any of these reasons might apply to this type of behavior? undiagnosed health or medical issue, developmental delay, social emotional environment, discontinuity between home and care program, lack of skill in communicating
Simpson, Steven07:14:15 pmIā€™d say lack of skills in communicating
Kelly, Lori07:14:37 pmSocial
{Hafner, Nancy}07:14:46 pmNichole, thank you for sharing some additional possibilities for why behaviors occur. It is great that you are able to recognize the "why" to help inform your response
Mottram, Nichole07:14:46 pmLack of skill in communicating.
Dougan, Peter07:14:51 pmIā€™d say developmental delay
Jirele, Ann07:14:56 pmDiscontinuity between home and program is a big one, i believe. Home life is rarely as structured as a program
Neuman, Jennifer07:15:10 pmLack of communication skills
Kelly, Lori07:15:13 pmLack of discipline at home and older siblings
Kronebusch, Michelle07:15:16 pmI would think it could be a mix of the last three. Seeing a power struggle between the two roles, if the two roles aren't communicating or following the same guidelines they wouldn't be connecting or communicating appropriately
Waters, Danielle07:15:36 pmAbsolutely. Lack of communication skills and also developmental delay
Athey, Lisa07:16:05 pmMy most challenging behaviors i believe come from discontinuity between home and childcare.
Klatt-Simpson, Deborah07:16:06 pmYes lack of communication skills is huge
{Hafner, Nancy}07:16:33 pmWithout knowing the details of what is happening before/during/after transition times, I agree that communication or developmental skills could be at play.
{Hafner, Nancy}07:18:05 pmAre we giving children enough warning time to make the transition effectively? What visual supports do we provide? Could the child who struggles be the "time keeper" and let everyone know there is 5 more minutes before clean up? These are some environmental strategies that could support children who struggle with transitions.
{Hafner, Nancy}07:18:29 pmLet's go back to the questions on the syllabus for tonight and continue *
Kronebusch, Michelle07:18:34 pm*
Mottram, Nichole07:18:38 pmGreat points! *
Jirele, Ann07:18:40 pm*
Neuman, Jennifer07:18:40 pm*
Kelly, Lori07:18:42 pm*
Simpson, Steven07:18:52 pm*
Athey, Lisa07:18:55 pm*
Klatt-Simpson, Deborah07:19:03 pm*
{Hafner, Nancy}07:19:12 pmHow do the following negatively impact a childā€™s reactions and behaviors: o Chronic stress o Temperament o Nutrition
{Hafner, Nancy}07:19:41 pmI left off parenting practices, as we commented a bit about the differences between home and care program already
{Hafner, Nancy}07:19:57 pmYou can speak to just one of these factors
Kronebusch, Michelle07:20:30 pmChronic stress can negatively impact a child as they are very reactive and may be always defensive to situations.
Klatt-Simpson, Deborah07:21:03 pmChronic stress would be a great negative impact, followed by nutritional needs not being met (I wonder sometimes if they ever eat at home)
Athey, Lisa07:21:08 pmtemperament can make it difficult to follow the routine and cause frustration.
Waters, Danielle07:21:19 pmWe see behavior issues with lack of nutrition/not eating enough. For instance, not getting in breakfast before the day begins or with a couple of our kids who barely touch food at lunch.
{Hafner, Nancy}07:21:29 pmAbsolutely! Defensive or needing to control some aspect of their lives, if life feels out of control at home
Kelly, Lori07:21:53 pmChronic stress can interfere with sleep, eating, and all around behavior
Mottram, Nichole07:22:09 pmTemperament can cause a level of chronic stress that can be difficult to navigate to meet milestones and key developments.
Jirele, Ann07:22:29 pmI am experiencing lack of nutrition with a child who cannot eat solid foods and just received a feeding tube. They were irritable, didn't sleep well, short temper, very sensitive
{Hafner, Nancy}07:22:33 pmYes, Danielle, think about Maslow's hierarchy of needs - food, shelter, clothing,
Neuman, Jennifer07:23:06 pmI see big differences in my kiddos if they are hungry. Its harder to focus, they can be over emotional, etc.
{Hafner, Nancy}07:23:12 pmGreat point, Lori! I just shared a podcast about sleep with students in my child development class!
Simpson, Steven07:23:16 pmIā€™m going with temperament. The children we have now are what I call perfect. But weā€™ve had children that have such a bad temperament, always getting in trouble, and bringing the other children with them. Talking to the parents did little good.
Mottram, Nichole07:23:37 pmI have a child that is highly sensitive, and it breaks my heart to see her in such stress. I am currently doing vagus nerve stiimulation through deep breaths, massage, and sensory stimulation. It is helping her interact with her environment so much more than she was able to tolerate before.
{Hafner, Nancy}07:24:10 pmThat is a difficult situation, Ann, and certainly understandable to how it may impact the child's behaviors
Dougan, Peter07:24:33 pmFor a temperament, it could be reflection of the parents behavior at home
{Hafner, Nancy}07:25:51 pmSteven, I cringe a bit at the phrase "bad temperament," - we like to use fearful, feisty, or calm. There are actually 9 different temperament traits that CSEFEL has used in their training modules.
{Hafner, Nancy}07:26:25 pmWhen our temperaments are not a "good fit" with a child, or opposite, it can cause difficulties!
{Hafner, Nancy}07:26:57 pmI want to highlight one of the readings for this week by Dan Gartrell*
Simpson, Steven07:27:00 pmI feel awful right now
{Hafner, Nancy}07:27:19 pmOh now - please don't!
Simpson, Steven07:27:41 pmNo I get it. Seriously.
{Hafner, Nancy}07:28:36 pmGartrell uses the phrase "mistaken behavior" in his work on guidance practices, "Seven Guidance Practices for Children Who Show Challenging Behaviors." What do you think about his phrase that children are making "mistakes" with behavior at times?
{Hafner, Nancy}07:29:33 pmThe child is seeking to find some sense of self in a world in which he otherwise feels insignificant and devalued (Carione & Mackrain, 2012). Adults say in these situations that the child ā€œjust wants atten tion,ā€ but what the child really is looking for is personal affirmation and a sense of belonging (Gartrell, 2012)
Mottram, Nichole07:31:08 pmThey are performing trial and error. Trying to find results suitable to meet the needs of the moment. Even as adults we find ourselves with mistaken behaviors. Children search for validation and acceptance, as we all do, but ill-intention is not a major factor in these trial and error behaviors.
Kronebusch, Michelle07:31:43 pmI think it very much depends on what type of behavior they are exhibiting to get the personal affirmation they are looking for.
Kelly, Lori07:32:15 pmI agree, Nichole! Theyā€™re just living and learning like the rest of us. Learning from mistakes
Waters, Danielle07:33:56 pmSometimes giving them the praise or attention they are looking for, helps make big strides as well in a positive way.
{Hafner, Nancy}07:34:24 pmI understand that this may be a difficult stance to embrace in those moments when children are hurting other children, disrupting our routines, or destroying property. But I mention it to give pause and consider what might actually be going on for this child.
Simpson, Steven07:34:32 pmAgreed Danielle
Athey, Lisa07:34:52 pmThey may be trying to contribute in a way that makes an impact. Like making art on my walls.
{Hafner, Nancy}07:35:22 pmI think this is a good segue back to an earlier question, the "hot button" activity. *
Simpson, Steven07:35:38 pm*
Neuman, Jennifer07:35:43 pm*
Jirele, Ann07:35:43 pm*
{Hafner, Nancy}07:35:49 pmWhat were your 'aha' take-aways from doing the hot button exercise?
Athey, Lisa07:35:51 pm*
Mottram, Nichole07:35:56 pm*
Klatt-Simpson, Deborah07:36:12 pmIf itā€™s repeated mistaken behavior then it depends on how many mistakes are involved šŸ˜‚ but we all make mistakes, and reminding them itā€™s ok is good
Klatt-Simpson, Deborah07:36:19 pm*
Kronebusch, Michelle07:36:35 pm*
{Hafner, Nancy}07:36:55 pmGood point, Deborah, "repeated patterns" require more intensive intervention strategies
Kelly, Lori07:37:22 pm*
Klatt-Simpson, Deborah07:37:25 pmIt just made me stop and think about the behaviors that annoy me and others, and try to work together to remedy the situation
Jirele, Ann07:37:27 pmThat I get frustrated, overstimulated and stubborn just like my kids do
Kelly, Lori07:37:44 pmMe too, Ann!
Simpson, Steven07:38:07 pmI never get frustratedā€¦. Noooooo
Jirele, Ann07:38:10 pmI just have the words and emotional IQ to respond
Neuman, Jennifer07:38:11 pmsame Ann, same
Mottram, Nichole07:38:39 pmI found that i become anxious when behaviors back up our daily routine. Sometimes, needing to take another teachable moment instead of preparing lunch becomes frustrating and overwhelming.
Waters, Danielle07:38:43 pmI agree with that. They can definitely feed off the vibe we are putting off ourselves
Athey, Lisa07:39:31 pmThat my hot buttons are more about me and my expectations and less about what the child is trying to accomplish.
Mottram, Nichole07:39:57 pmYes Lisa! Great point! Expectations not being met can create such anxiety!
{Hafner, Nancy}07:42:19 pmGreat insights into your hot buttons! Honest reflection about these things will make you a more attuned and responsive educarer!
{Hafner, Nancy}07:42:37 pmOne last question for tonight, I knew we would not get to all of them! *
Neuman, Jennifer07:42:45 pm*
Kelly, Lori07:42:46 pm*
Simpson, Steven07:42:48 pm*
Mottram, Nichole07:42:49 pm*
Klatt-Simpson, Deborah07:42:50 pm*
Jirele, Ann07:42:52 pm*
Athey, Lisa07:43:00 pm*
{Hafner, Nancy}07:44:15 pmWhat is one social skill you actively teach your children as a strategy for prevention of behaviors that interfere with children's ability to engage with others in a constructive way?
Mottram, Nichole07:45:05 pmUsing our "big voice". (not our loud voice :P)
Kelly, Lori07:45:28 pmAsking for help and using the sign language for help if they canā€™t talk
Athey, Lisa07:45:35 pmSome items we share, some we take turns, and help them figure out which are which. So simple, but most conflict is just this.
Waters, Danielle07:45:37 pmWe focus on communication a lot. Also expressing what you need.
Klatt-Simpson, Deborah07:46:19 pmI will give them the words they need to o communicate with myself and others
Jirele, Ann07:46:36 pmCommunication - help, space please, asking before touching the other person (hugs)
Kronebusch, Michelle07:46:43 pmI think I say "use your words" a million times a day. They need to communicate their wants, needs, and feelings.
Dougan, Peter07:46:46 pmWe focus on hearing our friends and have them try to work it out calmly together
Neuman, Jennifer07:47:18 pmTo use their words. Even if I am giving them the words to use and having them repete after me. We do this all day in different situations. sometimes to get a need met and sometimes to solve a conflict.
{Hafner, Nancy}07:47:33 pmGreat strategies, thank you all for sharing! Michelle, sometimes we need to actually give the children the words, too!
Mottram, Nichole07:47:50 pmhttps://consciousdiscipline.com/product/shuberts-big-voice/
{Hafner, Nancy}07:48:03 pmHave a great week everyone. Don't forget to post on the discussion board by Monday next week
Waters, Danielle07:48:23 pmThank you!
Kelly, Lori07:48:26 pmThank you!!
Simpson, Steven07:48:27 pmCommunicating is huge as everyone says. I sit on the floor with them to talk things out sometimes
Mottram, Nichole07:48:28 pmhttps://consciousdiscipline.com/product/sophies-big-voice/
Jirele, Ann07:48:29 pmGood night all!
Dougan, Peter07:48:42 pmThank you
Neuman, Jennifer07:48:45 pmthank you:)
Mottram, Nichole07:48:50 pmThose are some of the books we use to practice! Have a great night all!
Simpson, Steven07:48:56 pmGood night
Simpson, Steven07:49:33 pmBy the way, I tell my siblings my best friend is a four-year-old
{Hafner, Nancy}07:49:48 pmLove that, Steve!
{Hafner, Nancy}07:50:15 pmMy 6-year-old grandson told one of his teachers I was his best friend - it made my week!
Simpson, Steven07:52:55 pmI sure it did Nancy